Keep It Real wrote:

felltoearth wrote:What is clear from your statement above is how much you personalize the issue. I can tell you it isn’t a tack that is helping your cause.

You're the one who brought MY drinking into this thread fellto, so hypocrisy much TBH.

Oh lord. When I said personalize, I meant in the subjective sense. You are moralizing behaviour that isn’t actually deeply immoral and is pretty morally neutral compared to many other things when it comes to carbon use. Do the math and look at the reality. Air travel isn’t the low hanging fruit you presume it to be.

Keep It Real wrote:

laklak wrote:LIke Whitey Morgan says, if I'm goin' down tonight I'm goin' down drinkin.

The problem with "shaming" is it doesn't work. Neither does blockading city streets. It just pisses off the punters, because when you gotta get to work you gotta get to work. I mean, all those penguins are cute and shit, but I got a mortgage to pay and I've saved up all year for my trip to Spain, so get out of the fucking road.

What does work then Lak? We're all ears...

Nothing. We're doomed. It will be anti-gravity cities full of rich fuckers floating over a blasted, flooded Mad Max landscape. The Stand will look like Winnie the Pooh. My advice is get a boat and lots of ammo. Oh, and hydro weed. Don't forget the weed.

Keep It Real wrote:

Cito di Pense wrote:

Keep It Real wrote:False dichotomy.

I'm sure that one is going to keep someone out of a seat on an airliner.

It's just that not flying =/= Amish lifestyle.

Well, I certainly would not let myself get sidetracked by that. I'm not defending air travel, but if you push me, I will. I personally think the game is up whereby we rationally debate policies, discover the best ones, and implement them flawlessly, or at least without causing some other problem no one imagined.

Keep It Real wrote:It's not MY cause.

I wouldn't let myself get sidetracked by that, either. Gradually, you're going off message, just to try to respond to every post that fails to acknowledge your good graces, and that is on you.

laklak wrote:We're doomed.

Not very "Spirit of the Blitz" Lak.

Keep It Real wrote:

laklak wrote:We're doomed.

Not very "Spirit of the Blitz" Lak.

Appeal to emotion, but let's just can it with the rhetorical fallacies. There's nobody with whom to score points.

Wherever I go, I fight my way through crowds of well-to-do young parents and their little gits. The newborns will surely live to see the year 2100 unless things go the way I think they will some time before that. I don't really think they have the long view, and it's not my job to prepare the way for their gits to have a full and happy life. I'm childless, and glad of it, because not even having someone to refuse to take care of me in my old age is compensation for the damage I'd know I'd done just by putting them on their legs.

I'm not trying to score points, and never have been, so fuck you very much Cito, I earn them I earn them, accuse me of virtue signalling at your peril, I call it how I see it, nothing else. I can't stand this "we're doomed, so why try, burn 'em while you got 'em" attitude RE AGW - it can go fuck a donkey dick on viagra IMO. Word.

I'm glad there are optimistic youngsters out there, fighting the good fight and all that. We were gonna usher in the Age of Aquarius, but it didn't pan out. Maybe you'll succeed where we failed. Ho Ho Ho Chi Minh, you know the left is gonna WIN! (IIRC).

Just because the entirety of human history is a sordid tale of death and destruction doesn't mean this time won't be different. Ask a Mayan, if you can find one, I'm sure they have some tips.

Sun powered planes flying slow and high.

RS

Solar Zeppelins, man, that's the ticket. Takes 5 days to get to London and you dress for dinner.

laklak wrote:I'm glad there are optimistic youngsters out there, fighting the good fight and all that. We were gonna usher in the Age of Aquarius, but it didn't pan out. Maybe you'll succeed where we failed. Ho Ho Ho Chi Minh, you know the left is gonna WIN! (IIRC).

Just because the entirety of human history is a sordid tale of death and destruction doesn't mean this time won't be different. Ask a Mayan, if you can find one, I'm sure they have some tips.

I guess it must be terminally depressing in Lak world. It's true, I'd rather live in Lithuania than the states, so I guess I empathise.

I suspect Lak-world™ is a better, brighter one than most of us have.

As Greta is 'on the spectrum', she should become fluent in Chinese, as she travels the Trans Siberian Express to the cause of the real problems.
Can't wait to see how that would turn out.

Accepting reality isn't depressing, it's, well, acceptance. Besides, Ma Nature gave us Holy Weed for those inevitable moments of existential angst. Helps one abide, just don't overdo it.

laklak wrote:

Keep It Real wrote:

laklak wrote:LIke Whitey Morgan says, if I'm goin' down tonight I'm goin' down drinkin.

The problem with "shaming" is it doesn't work. Neither does blockading city streets. It just pisses off the punters, because when you gotta get to work you gotta get to work. I mean, all those penguins are cute and shit, but I got a mortgage to pay and I've saved up all year for my trip to Spain, so get out of the fucking road.

What does work then Lak? We're all ears...

Nothing. We're doomed. It will be anti-gravity cities full of rich fuckers floating over a blasted, flooded Mad Max landscape. The Stand will look like Winnie the Pooh. My advice is get a boat and lots of ammo. Oh, and hydro weed. Don't forget the weed.

:rofl:
You are a fucking nutbar. Any space on that raft of yours?

Bring beer.

as she travels the Trans Siberian Express to the cause of the real problems.

yeah right ....

China Is Set To Become The World's Renewable Energy Superpower ...
https://www.forbes.com/sites/dominicdud ... uperpower/
Jan 11, 2019 - This means that many countries which currently have to import most of their energy ... China also has a clear lead in terms of the underlying technology, with well ..

8 Ways China Is Encouraging Zero-Subsidy Renewables | Greentech ...
https://www.greentechmedia.com/articles ... renewables
Jan 17, 2019 - The Chinese National Energy Administration has released a package of .... Zhao, so regional planners might be more willing to consider renewables as a way of ...

I guess she will get to the US via umiak and Alaska

felltoearth wrote:Speaking of low hanging fruit....

The Environmental Impact of Alcohol

There are a number of ways in which alcohol production negatively impacts the planet, starting with the process of growing the ingredients necessary to produce alcohol. Grains, potatoes, rice, botanicals, sugar cane, and agave are all significant ingredients in the alcohol industry, each of which require a significant amount of water, fertilizer, land, and use of machinery.

In essence, these resources are being used to produce beverages that aren’t necessary for human survival, which could be diverted to providing food aid for those in need.

Physician, heal thyself.

Not necessary for human survival? Do they have any idea how many babies are a direct result of drunken relationships?

minininja wrote:

SafeAsMilk wrote:
There are these things called "distances", however, you might have heard of them? Part of my immediate family lives on the west coast, another part in the deep south. I'm in the north. Would you suggest we take a horse and buggy to visit each other?

Just out of curiosity, if cheap and fast travel via the air had never been an option, do you think your family would have spread out so far? If suddenly all flights were permanently grounded do you think you would all eventually move closer together?

Obviously it's difficult to adjust when people have got used to living their lives with a particular convenience, if that is then lost.

Most definitely. I don't know if we wouldn't have spread out as much, I'm guessing coast-to-coast wouldn't have happened, but I bet north to south probably would. If flying was suddenly gone, we may move closer together. But at least for me anyway, even ignoring the local culture problems, I couldn't live just anywhere to do my work.

But if we'd started taking climate change seriously 40 years ago there'd be a lot of people that might have happily lived most of their lives without it, or less damaging alternatives might have been developed.

If we're going to start taking climate change seriously now, we need to start questioning every aspect of how we live our lives.

I'm of the mind that the solution has always been with technology. I think most people share lak's view, if not his acceptance that we're fucked, then the willful ignorance of it. For decades, we should've been putting our energy into making resource consumption have as little impact as possible. I'm honestly of the mind that it's too late now, both in terms of being able to develop the technology quick enough to avoid catastrophe, and in terms of realistically and significantly changing people's behavior. Even something as impossibly drastic as grounding all planes tomorrow wouldn't be nearly enough, let alone what's actually needed.

laklak wrote:I'll fly where and when I want. Fuck 'em sideways.

I refuse to bend the knee, submitting to security nazis, to be treated like criminal cattle. Fuck ‘em sideways.

laklak wrote:Accepting reality isn't depressing, it's, well, acceptance. Besides, Ma Nature gave us Holy Weed for those inevitable moments of existential angst. Helps one abide, just don't overdo it.

I haven’t found the overdone point yet.

I did with the latest batch. Hit my usual nightly bowl and was sick as a dog, head spinning and puking. That's the problem with illegal weed, you just don't know what your getting. On the plus side, it only takes half as much.

Don't get me started on the fucking TSA. If there was any other way to get to Swaziland I'd take it, I absolutely loathe flying. Crammed into a metal tube with a bunch of other ground apes for 17 hours is hell, no matter how much you drink.