Can personal experience be evidence of the paranormal?

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Re: Can personal experience be evidence of the paranormal?

#1381  Postby kyrani99 » May 29, 2016 3:29 pm

Agrippina wrote:

Not only lacking in humility, but insulting to the people who've suffered through cancer, and gone into remission as a result of actual scientific treatments, which are living hell to the patients and their families, and can sometimes lead to serious financial loss, which families are prepared to suffer for their loved ones.

It is also an insult to the memory of brave people who go through the punishing rigour of oncology, only to die anyway, like my eldest sister whose breast cancer was detected to late, by which time it had already metastasized to the bones in her chest, after two years of excruciating treatments, this very dignified, daughter, sister, wife, mother, and grandmother died, and not only that, the cancer further devastated her mother, sisters, and family when her husband died on the way to her funeral. Don't insult those of us who've lost family members because of cancer. There is only one way to treat it and that is to get regular checkups, consult medical professionals, take the surgeries and treatments recommended, and if you're lucky enough to go into remission, thank science that you live in a modern world where science, and not bullshit, is available to help people who acquire this terrible disease.

I heavy dose of working in a hospice for a few weeks, taking care of people who are dying as a result of treatments like yours would go a long way towards ridding you of your hubris.


It is early days yet but I will have the evidence I need, the medical evidence.
You might be happy with medical treatments and the only guarantees of survival defined as 5 years of life after diagnosis, or false positives and unnecessary treatments or false negatives for your people, but there are many, many people who are screaming about the what the doctors dish up. And you think that if I have information that can help another person get well that I should keep it to myself or risk being called arrogant or lacking in humility? You don't stop to think that there wouldn't be an alternative medical system if everyone was happy with the conventional therapies.

I have seen close friend and relatives die of cancer. I don't need to go to some hospice to see the drama. I have seen it in my own life. Who do you think you are telling me what I have or have not experienced in my life and what I have found to have saved my life? The first lot of doctors threw me in the trash. Nothing we can do, you got 6 to live, 12 months if you're lucky.
And they were nice. There were others subsequently claiming that when I needed their help they would butcher me. They were certainly hopeful but I was able to make myself well. You bet I will put the boot in them.

I am going to prove the matter scientifically and rub their faces in it. :thumbup:
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Re: Can personal experience be evidence of the paranormal?

#1382  Postby Scar » May 29, 2016 3:31 pm

kyrani99 wrote:
Fallible wrote:
kyrani99 wrote:

I haven't professed to be an expert in neuroscience but oncology is another matter. IMO I can talk with more authority than an oncologist, after all I have mastered deliberately effecting spontaneous remission. :fly: An oncologist can't even dream of doing that.


No you haven't, luv.

That is only your opinion. However I know my reality.

Fallible wrote:
kyrani99 wrote:I don't see that talking about and expressing my views and beliefs makes me lacking in humility. And as far as my own abilities are concerned, I believe I can accurately appraise what I am capable of and what I am not. :)


Of course you do. Unfortunately, lots of completely clueless people also believe they can accurately appraise what they are capable of and what they are not, so your favourable opinion of yourself has no value to anyone but yourself.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dunning%E2%80%93Kruger_effect


I don't know how these guys did this experiment but I don't see that it adds up to real life.
In 52 years of adult life and having been both of a migrant family and worked at a university for many years, I have been among both learned people and those with little or no education. And I have not seen this effect. There is sometimes one or two people who might overestimate what they can do or miscalculate what another can or cannot do but it is a trivial effect. 1 in thousands.

The effects that I have consistently seen are:
1. some educated people think they are a cut above others and expect that others should hang off their every word, and
2. uneducated people refusing to accept stuff just because some academic or doctor etc said so.

One piece of evidence is that a large number of totally uneducated people, who are able to use their wit, go into business and make a success of it. My father was one of them and many other successful business people he associated with had also no formal education worth speak of.


You pretending to magically cure cancer is still despicable and dangerous. I hope you don't kill someone in the long run by peddling your woo.
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Re: Can personal experience be evidence of the paranormal?

#1383  Postby kyrani99 » May 29, 2016 3:38 pm

Shrunk wrote:
kyrani99 wrote:
Fallible wrote:
kyrani99 wrote:

I haven't professed to be an expert in neuroscience but oncology is another matter. IMO I can talk with more authority than an oncologist, after all I have mastered deliberately effecting spontaneous remission. :fly: An oncologist can't even dream of doing that.


No you haven't, luv.

That is only your opinion. However I know my reality.


While there may be some things that a person could know to be true without being able to demonstrate this to others, this is not one of them. The existence and subsequent disappearance of a malignant tumor is something you could only know of if it was confirmed to you by a qualified specialist. In which case, it would also be readily demonstrable to others. This claim of yours sits uncomfortably close to being a lie.


The first episode, which was stage 4 ovarian cancer, was diagnosed by several doctors because I wanted a second opinion and the remission or what they called NED (no evidence of disease) was also verified by doctors. The information exists.
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Re: Can personal experience be evidence of the paranormal?

#1384  Postby kyrani99 » May 29, 2016 3:42 pm

Scar wrote:

You pretending to magically cure cancer is still despicable and dangerous. I hope you don't kill someone in the long run by peddling your woo.


Magically???????????????????????????
Magically might be in your mind but it is nowhere else.
I have studied my case and that of others and I am going to put forth MEDICAL EVIDENCE. :thumbup:

And while you are busy hassling me you don't seem to count the fact that cancer is an industry. A cure would be really bad news. I guess you feel okay about that.
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Re: Can personal experience be evidence of the paranormal?

#1385  Postby surreptitious57 » May 29, 2016 3:48 pm

kyrani99 wrote:
No I am not claiming it as a fact I am saying that it is something I know
For it to be a fact I have to be able to give evidence that is convincing for you

If you truly know something then that is a fact regardless of whether or not anyone else knows it
But it is not determined by how convincing evidence is but on whether or not it is non falsifiable
So then how popular or unpopular it might be is entirely irrelevant with regard to its truth value
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Re: Can personal experience be evidence of the paranormal?

#1386  Postby kyrani99 » May 29, 2016 4:07 pm

surreptitious57 wrote:
kyrani99 wrote:
There is NO evidence that either the mind or consciousness are generated by the brain

Do you think the mind or consciousness can function independently of the brain ? If you do then
where do they emanate from ? And also why do they cease functioning when brain death occurs


NDE is the most striking evidence of consciousness being independent of the brain.

From what I have seen the brain enables a conscious being to have physical experiences.

When we say that a person has "lost consciousness" we are really talking about that person no longer being able to interact with us or be aware of their environment through the means of the body (brain is part of the body). However there are countless cases where a person has lost consciousness and being worked on by doctors to be brought back, while that person is aware of others and other places outside of the place where doctors are working to resuscitate him or her.

It is one thing to say that they may be aware of the doctors and nurses and the ward or theatre they are in. It is quite another story when they can accurately relate events that are even outside of the hospital. It is not evidence in the sense of some biological process we can study but maybe that will come in the future.

Do "they" cease functioning? We associated self with the body hence we say "they cease functioning" but in reality it is the physical body that has ceased to function when consciousness or conscious being (self) moves out of it or is no longer linked to it.

Where do we emanate from?
All I can say is that there is an Ultimate Reality, which is spiritual, and I can say that because of enlightenment experiences. This is not evidence that I can give you. I know it sounds strange but enlightenment experience is not subjective experience.
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Re: Can personal experience be evidence of the paranormal?

#1387  Postby SafeAsMilk » May 29, 2016 4:13 pm

kyrani99 wrote:
Scar wrote:

You pretending to magically cure cancer is still despicable and dangerous. I hope you don't kill someone in the long run by peddling your woo.


Magically???????????????????????????
Magically might be in your mind but it is nowhere else.
I have studied my case and that of others and I am going to put forth MEDICAL EVIDENCE. :thumbup:

And while you are busy hassling me you don't seem to count the fact that cancer is an industry. A cure would be really bad news. I guess you feel okay about that.

Yes, because nobody would make any money off a cure for cancer :lol:

Thanks for yet another tediously predictable, poorly-considered conspiracy theory.
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Re: Can personal experience be evidence of the paranormal?

#1388  Postby kyrani99 » May 29, 2016 4:16 pm

surreptitious57 wrote:
kyrani99 wrote:
No I am not claiming it as a fact I am saying that it is something I know
For it to be a fact I have to be able to give evidence that is convincing for you


If you truly know something then that is a fact regardless of whether or not anyone else knows it
But it is not determined by how convincing evidence is but on whether or not it is non falsifiable
So then how popular or unpopular it might be is entirely irrelevant with regard to its truth value


A theory or hypothesis is considered falsifiable from a scientific perspective because in science we can only bring forth evidence. We cannot provide every case, which may be millions or infinite. If we could it would be proof and thus non falsifiable.

Strictly speaking "I know it for a fact" but I can't claim it a fact in the common domain because the proof that I have is not in the common domain.
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Re: Can personal experience be evidence of the paranormal?

#1389  Postby Scar » May 29, 2016 4:28 pm

kyrani99 wrote:
Scar wrote:

You pretending to magically cure cancer is still despicable and dangerous. I hope you don't kill someone in the long run by peddling your woo.


Magically???????????????????????????
Magically might be in your mind but it is nowhere else.
I have studied my case and that of others and I am going to put forth MEDICAL EVIDENCE. :thumbup:

And while you are busy hassling me you don't seem to count the fact that cancer is an industry. A cure would be really bad news. I guess you feel okay about that.

:crazy:
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Re: Can personal experience be evidence of the paranormal?

#1390  Postby Shrunk » May 29, 2016 4:30 pm

kyrani99 wrote:The first episode, which was stage 4 ovarian cancer, was diagnosed by several doctors because I wanted a second opinion and the remission or what they called NED (no evidence of disease) was also verified by doctors. The information exists.


So let's see it. :coffee:

To be clear, this would not substantiate your claim that you are able to induce remission just thru thinking cancers away. But at least this one aspect of your claim can be substantiated.
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Re: Can personal experience be evidence of the paranormal?

#1391  Postby kyrani99 » May 29, 2016 4:40 pm

SafeAsMilk wrote:
kyrani99 wrote:
Scar wrote:

You pretending to magically cure cancer is still despicable and dangerous. I hope you don't kill someone in the long run by peddling your woo.


Magically???????????????????????????
Magically might be in your mind but it is nowhere else.
I have studied my case and that of others and I am going to put forth MEDICAL EVIDENCE. :thumbup:

And while you are busy hassling me you don't seem to count the fact that cancer is an industry. A cure would be really bad news. I guess you feel okay about that.

Yes, because nobody would make any money off a cure for cancer :lol:

Thanks for yet another tediously predictable, poorly-considered conspiracy theory.


Conspiracy theory? Man open your peepers and have a look around, put your thinking cap on.
FINANCIERS control the medical industry. These are the super rich multinationals. They dictate what is taught at university, what a doctor can say and do and what governments and governing bodies can do.

You reckon they will make money from a cure! Look at the situation.
They are busy milking the person, their insurance company and the government, for as much as they can and for as long as they can. Do you really think that a cure will be profitable, when you see this happening?

Medical ethics is all about stopping doctors from operating repeatedly or continuing to perform some intervention until there is nothing left of the person, until they can be thrown in the trash.

I am not going to walk around like a goody two shoes and with blinkers on! I am with those that are vocal.
And what I have to say is not about a cure. Fuck that. I am about not having to get cancer ever!

There have been many attacks on me, with the view to cause me cancer, since 2010 and I have been able to avoid developing cancer. I am sailing on an even keel! And I know that it is only a matter of information. When a humane person understands what is involved they too can avoid getting cancer. Those that are on the war path against me have two motives. One is certainly that I am exposing how evil people operate. But the other is because I am seriously bad for business. :clap:
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Re: Can personal experience be evidence of the paranormal?

#1392  Postby SafeAsMilk » May 29, 2016 4:48 pm

kyrani99 wrote:
SafeAsMilk wrote:
kyrani99 wrote:
Scar wrote:

You pretending to magically cure cancer is still despicable and dangerous. I hope you don't kill someone in the long run by peddling your woo.


Magically???????????????????????????
Magically might be in your mind but it is nowhere else.
I have studied my case and that of others and I am going to put forth MEDICAL EVIDENCE. :thumbup:

And while you are busy hassling me you don't seem to count the fact that cancer is an industry. A cure would be really bad news. I guess you feel okay about that.

Yes, because nobody would make any money off a cure for cancer :lol:

Thanks for yet another tediously predictable, poorly-considered conspiracy theory.


Conspiracy theory? Man open your peepers and have a look around, put your thinking cap on.
FINANCIERS control the medical industry. These are the super rich multinationals. They dictate what is taught at university, what a doctor can say and do and what governments and governing bodies can do.

You reckon they will make money from a cure! Look at the situation.
They are busy milking the person, their insurance company and the government, for as much as they can and for as long as they can. Do you really think that a cure will be profitable, when you see this happening?

Hmmmm, let's see, medicine that every single person who has cancer will buy...gee, you think it'll make a profit? :lol:

You also seem to be working under the assumption that the cure will be popping one bill and never have to deal with cancer again. Talk about closed peepers!

Medical ethics is all about stopping doctors from operating repeatedly or continuing to perform some intervention until there is nothing left of the person, until they can be thrown in the trash.

I am not going to walk around like a goody two shoes and with blinkers on! I am with those that are vocal.

Unfortunately, like most of the other vocal people, you haven't a fucking clue what you're talking about. As usual, the emptiest can rattles the most.

And what I have to say is not about a cure. Fuck that. I am about not having to get cancer ever!

There have been many attacks on me, with the view to cause me cancer, since 2010 and I have been able to avoid developing cancer. I am sailing on an even keel! And I know that it is only a matter of information. When a humane person understands what is involved they too can avoid getting cancer. Those that are on the war path against me have two motives. One is certainly that I am exposing how evil people operate. But the other is because I am seriously bad for business. :clap:

:crazy: Well as long as you've managed to convince yourself that any of the nonsense you say is true, that's all that matters, right?
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Re: Can personal experience be evidence of the paranormal?

#1393  Postby surreptitious57 » May 29, 2016 4:52 pm

kyrani99 wrote:
NDE is the most striking evidence of consciousness being independent of the brain

Neuroscience regards NDE as hallucinations with a psychological or physical cause
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Re: Can personal experience be evidence of the paranormal?

#1394  Postby SafeAsMilk » May 29, 2016 4:55 pm

surreptitious57 wrote:
kyrani99 wrote:
NDE is the most striking evidence of consciousness being independent of the brain

Neuroscience regards NDE as hallucinations with a psychological or physical cause

Yes, but Kyrani knows that it's her personal opinion that it's not :lol:
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Re: Can personal experience be evidence of the paranormal?

#1395  Postby GrahamH » May 29, 2016 4:57 pm

kyrani99 wrote:
surreptitious57 wrote:
kyrani99 wrote:
There is NO evidence that either the mind or consciousness are generated by the brain

Do you think the mind or consciousness can function independently of the brain ? If you do then
where do they emanate from ? And also why do they cease functioning when brain death occurs


NDE is the most striking evidence of consciousness being independent of the brain.

From what I have seen the brain enables a conscious being to have physical experiences.

When we say that a person has "lost consciousness" we are really talking about that person no longer being able to interact with us or be aware of their environment through the means of the body (brain is part of the body).


That is a definition, but more relevant to your argument is a definition that covers the evident loss of experience between experiences of going under and coming round. We don't just carry on being conscious but lose connection with the world around us. We stop. We all know this.
Why do you think that?
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Re: Can personal experience be evidence of the paranormal?

#1396  Postby SafeAsMilk » May 29, 2016 5:03 pm

kyrani99 wrote:
FINANCIERS control the medical industry. These are the super rich multinationals. They dictate what is taught at university, what a doctor can say and do and what governments and governing bodies can do.

You reckon they will make money from a cure! Look at the situation.
They are busy milking the person, their insurance company and the government, for as much as they can and for as long as they can. Do you really think that a cure will be profitable, when you see this happening?

Medical ethics is all about stopping doctors from operating repeatedly or continuing to perform some intervention until there is nothing left of the person, until they can be thrown in the trash.

Because, of course, none of these super-rich multinationals EVER get cancer, they want to be part of your alleged system of exploitation too. They'd NEVER support a cure for cancer :lol:

As usual, your conspiracy theory falls apart at even the most cursory glance. Back to the drawing board.
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Re: Can personal experience be evidence of the paranormal?

#1397  Postby GrahamH » May 29, 2016 5:08 pm

kyrani99 wrote:There have been many attacks on me, with the view to cause me cancer, since 2010 and I have been able to avoid developing cancer. I am sailing on an even keel! And I know that it is only a matter of information. When a humane person understands what is involved they too can avoid getting cancer. Those that are on the war path against me have two motives. One is certainly that I am exposing how evil people operate. But the other is because I am seriously bad for business. :clap:


So let's get this straight. What you claim is that "toxic people" somehow "attack you" (but no "Psi" ability involved) expressly to cause you to cause your own cancer. The consequence of this is that you think you cured your cancer, and this tennis match constitutes a great threat to some unspecified healthcare business if you convince anyone of your story about preventing/curing cancer. If they want you to shut up abut this why would they keep giving you ammunition?
Even suppose they gave you cancer in the first place, once you "cured yourself" the last thing they should do is give you any more opportunities to demonstrate anything. If they really wanted you dead they would surely use a more reliable method that your positive thinking could not defeat. People prepared to kill people with cancer an hardly have any qualms about killing people by other means.
They must be incredibly stupid, or the whole story is pure fiction.
Why do you think that?
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Re: Can personal experience be evidence of the paranormal?

#1398  Postby the_5th_ape » May 29, 2016 5:27 pm

kyrani99, please come back with some medical evidence to support your fantastic stories. Till then nobody here will take you seriously.
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Re: Can personal experience be evidence of the paranormal?

#1399  Postby kyrani99 » May 29, 2016 5:37 pm

Shrunk wrote:
kyrani99 wrote:The first episode, which was stage 4 ovarian cancer, was diagnosed by several doctors because I wanted a second opinion and the remission or what they called NED (no evidence of disease) was also verified by doctors. The information exists.


So let's see it. :coffee:

To be clear, this would not substantiate your claim that you are able to induce remission just thru thinking cancers away. But at least this one aspect of your claim can be substantiated.


NO NO NO NO NO! No not "thinking cancer away"

A nocebo effect, which is disease, is created by a person's reaction to beliefs.

For example if they believe that they may have touched something toxic, some plant for instance, they may ignite an inflammatory response. The idea or belief is of having suffered actual harm. The inflammatory response is unnecessary, if the idea/belief is false. The inflammatory response may appear as a rash or allergy if it is ongoing.

If that same person were to understand that the idea/belief was false then they quite simply stop reacting. The body stops the inflammatory response and cleans up. The body heals. This is the placebo effect. It is not magic. It is logical processes taking place when the body clears away some unnecessary reactivity (terminates the nocebo effect).

What I am going to show is that in cancer the reaction is to an idea of possible harm. (if this is coupled with an idea of actual harm then there is also an inflammatory response nearby). What happens, when the person reacts, is that stem cells become involved. They develop a complex or barrier to try and contain the problem perceived or prevent the problem perceived. And they are aided by other cells including immune system cells.

When the person realizes that the idea/belief is false, then they stop reacting. The body reverts the cells back to normal stem cells and any and all excesses are removed by apoptosis.

This has nothing to do with "thinking cancer away". It only requires an aha experience. I have tried to explain it with an analogy here in my introductory video https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GsBiTwhvbqM between 8mins 50secs and 10 mins 40 secs.

The body does the job of cleaning up and restoring health. :thumbup:


And part of what I need to disprove is the medical story. The idea that we get cancer cells forming every day and that the immune system kills them normally. This is BULLSHIT. I am still not knowledgeable enough about the mice used but I will get there. The immuno-editing story is false and I need to show evidence for that.

The immune system is involved in cancer. The story about cancer cells co-opting the immune system cells is also bull. And not only the immune system but also stromal and other cells in the area are involved. They become part of the micro environment. All this can be shown when I can put forth the entire mechanism that leads to cancer in scientific terms.

It can also be demonstrated in volunteers. You might find that unethical, but we are not talking about generating some advanced cancer. I am talking about using the foul game play to cause the person to react as to create a rice size cancer, big enough for a needle biopsy to be done and verified by medical tests. Then to debrief the person so that they stop reacting and can thus see for themselves that the little mass is cleared away. They have an aha experience. :jump: This is immensely powerful, extremely liberating. The person moves away from a state of fear to a state of knowledge from which they hold control over their health. They can maintain their health even under punishing conditions. This is ethical. :thumbup:
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Re: Can personal experience be evidence of the paranormal?

#1400  Postby kyrani99 » May 29, 2016 5:38 pm

the_5th_ape wrote:kyrani99, please come back with some medical evidence to support your fantastic stories. Till then nobody here will take you seriously.


Of course!
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