Sunday June 24th (anti-christmas day) will be "Atheists' Go To Church Day". It is officially called Atheists for Peaceful Cooexistence.

The intention of this event is to attend a church of one's choosing in order to show yourselves friendly, decent, good citizens; as a reminder to believers that they share this world--in fact their very neighborhoods--with non-believers who feel that a secular society that recognizes no scripture as its foundation is the best known bulwark against tyrranical persecution. It will serve to show church members who have doubts about their faith that they are not alone and should not fear these doubts. The event is not a rally or protest or picket line. It is simply the peaceful attendance of atheists in churches everywhere.

THWOTH (on another thread) has encapsulated an apt anthem for this event, as follows:

Secularism is the only principle which guarantees your freedom to practice your religion, because it is a principle which allows all religions to operate freely within a framework of non-partisan, independent, neutral law.

The law must remain neutral in religious matters, as it must in all others. If the law is to be fair and operated for the benefit and protection of all members of society then it cannot grant one group or section of society rights, privileges, or exemptions under the law that it would deny to all others.

Just as the Christian members of society have no urge to live under social, economic, and political conditions applied according to the principles of, say, Islam or Hinduism... nor should they be obliged or compelled to do so... neither should the non-believer, the atheist, be obliged to live under conditions set by Hindus, Christians, Muslims, or the members of any other religious tradition.

In this respect, all reasonable and responsible members of society require and desire the same thing of society... that it aspires to, embodies, and upholds the principles of fairness, tolerance, and peacefulness.

We all desire this...
...as we desire that our democratic institutions extend and ensure our continuing freedom to follow whatever creed we choose...
...as we desire that our social, economic, and political systems treasure that freedom as highly as we do, and protect it by all possible means...

Secularism is not at all at odds with these fine, reasonable aspirations - it represents these aspirations.

The secular principle does not seek to diminish people's right to practice their religion...
...it does not seek to 'do away with' religion...
...it does not seek to repress or oppress religion, or the religious...
...far from it...

Secularism simply guarantees that no person's religion trumps, favours, benefits, or unduly privileges them over the others members of society.... and in order to achieve this it recognises that the public sphere must remain as independent and as neutral as possible.

Only within a secular society can we hope to maintain neutrality in governance and in the law...
...so that they can both act freely...
...independently...
...for the benefit, well-being, and protection of all citizens equally...
...no matter what their religious beliefs...

Only within a secular society can we hope to maintain that vital... ...necessary freedom to follow whatever religion we choose, and to live our lives according to its principles as responsible...
...peaceful...
...tolerant...
...law-abiding citizens...

And only within a secular society can we hope to limit the undue social, economic and political influences that some groups might seek to gain and impose over the rest of us...
...influences which seek to undermine the very principles which we hold dear...

If we wish to maintain a free and fair society, administered on behalf of us all...
..on behalf of our children, on behalf of our grandchildren and the coming generations...
...if we wish to ensure a continuation of our fine social and political traditions of Liberty and Justice for all regardless of creed, colour, social or political inclinations...
...then we...
...the religious and the atheist alike...
...have a common interest, and thus a common cause;
...to aspire to, and make positive movements towards, a truly fair...
...truly tolerant...
...truly peaceable....
....truly free...

.....truly secular society.


Well said. Again, that will be June 24th. Some recommendations include:

Do not attend alone unless you have reasonable expectations of an incident-free experience.
Introduce yourself, tell them why you are there, and be friendly.
Remain afterward to socialize if that is acceptable.
Perhaps a uniform like black shirt with red tie (black blouse with red scarf) would prove effective but is entirely optional.
Do not be afraid to wear an atheist pin or other (appropriate) identifying accoutrements.
Atheists in local areas might wish to meet up and attend in a large group at a large and significant church.
Spread the word!

That's the plan. Save the day!

Meh. I go every Sunday.

Your forebearance in the face of the church crowd is admirable

pelfdaddy wrote:Your forebearance in the face of the church crowd is admirable

They require no more forebearance than any other crowd of people under most circumstances. When they get judgmental and go on about gays or fornication or whatever, I like to gently engage them- just a little- and try to get them to think about why they've reached that conclusion and how it stands up when taken with their perceived precepts of their faith. Sometimes I make a little progress. More importantly, I often encourage others in the congregation who are also uncomfortable with some of the bigotry to speak up themselves. They realize they aren't the only voice for their viewpoint and I've shown them you don't have to be an acerbic arsehole to present it.

Just a little nudge, now and then. Aside from that, I'm a quiet, polite and reliable part of the congregation. All that, and I'm openly atheist.

I'm very glad my girlfriend invited me to church.

I think that is not only quite interesting but effective as well. The whole idea of having a Go To Church day for non-believers is to introduce a brief taste of what you are doing do many other churches.

I have no inclination or desire to do any such thing. It's a stupid idea. A fucking stunt.

Wouldn't set foot in one, couldn't care less what they think of me.

Oldskeptic and laklak offer sentiments with which I find it hard to disagree at times. Some of us would simply like to try something a little different, just one thing among many. It may indeed turn out to be a stupid idea, I'll admit. My favorite thing about skeptics is their skepticism. We'll see what happens...or what doesn't happen.

laklak wrote:Wouldn't set foot in one, couldn't care less what they think of me.

This.

Oldskeptic wrote:I have no inclination or desire to do any such thing. It's a stupid idea. A fucking stunt.

And this.

The entire idea is so fucking hypocritical I can't believe we're offering this as a rational idea. We rail against the religious constantly interjecting their belief structure into our lives, by knocking on our doors, sending us mailings, coming into our homes on TV, and trying to convert others to their ideology. What is one of our solutions to addressing this? Going to them to initiate conversations about our lack of beliefs, doing the exact bullshit we complain to them about.

How is this being thought of as anything but a joke? This is a very, very stupid idea.

pelfdaddy wrote:Oldskeptic and laklak offer sentiments with which I find it hard to disagree at times. Some of us would simply like to try something a little different, just one thing among many. It may indeed turn out to be a stupid idea, I'll admit. My favorite thing about skeptics is their skepticism. We'll see what happens...or what doesn't happen.

Something a little different? The religious have been doing this shit for years, and it's one of the most complained about things when we discuss the religious.

I understand the motivation, pelfdaddy. Show them that we're human, we love our kids, that sort of thing. Might even work with some of the more humanistic congregations - unitarians or something like that. But dealing with your basic Southern Baptist is like talking to a rock. A rabid rock, with a shotgun. They fucking HATE atheists - literally hate us. We're worse than pedophiles, worse than communist muslim homo terrorists.

They do everything in their power to disenfranchise us, to marginalize us and shove their stupid superstitions down our throats. They would deny me the vote, deny me civil rights, hell - they'd deny me citizenship given their way. I've had people say I shouldn't be allowed to raise kids. They want to take over the education system, throw logic and science out the window and drag us all kicking and screaming back into the middle ages. No, there is no 'civil discourse' with these people, they're ignorant assholes, and what worse, they're PROUD of it.

The only thing I want to say to them is FUCK OFF AND LEAVE ME ALONE.

laklak,

Thanks for the passion! Everything you say is well-founded and correct from my experience. This event however is not a feeble attempt to say, "We're normal" as though we have some explaining to do. This is an attempt to say, "you have to share this world with us", and place them in a position to either accept it or tell us to leave. Doing this in a non-confrontational way should not be misconstrued as weakness.

I hope that helps. It was discussed in another thread and received mixed feedback, so I'm just giving it a whirl.

pelfdaddy wrote:Sunday June 24th (anti-christmas day) will be "Atheists' Go To Church Day". It is officially called Atheists for Peaceful Cooexistence.

The only peaceful coexistence that can occur is when religious people keep their religion to themselves.

Us invading their space is directly contradictory to that.

I don't appreciate it when theists intrude upon me, why would I presume to intrude upon them?

Tbickle,

Thanks for the feedback. Really. It's hard to respond immediately to your objections, because...well, you may be right. But the fact that your point had not occurred to me probably means that what you are describing is not exactly the reason for the exercise.

By the way, do you actually shun all efforts to persuade believers? Do you think that is the norm among atheists? It had not seemed so. Maybe I had not noticed. Really.

Interesting approach, though I'd hate to draw the straw for the First Church of The Blood of the Holy Apostolic Lamb. I await the results with a mixture of trepidation and anticipation.

MrFungus,

Objections of this type are sensible and thoughtful, but just a touch too easy. I'm not accusing you of being overly dogmatic, but are we satisfied with "keep to yourself and we'll get along fine"? I find it difficult to settle for that. Your skepticism, like that of others, is why I come to this forum after all. And maybe this idea of mine is Quixotic to a fault.

But I'm a risk-taker by nature...

If you have not read the thread Infidels in the House, a more detailed picture is offered there...

laklak,

There will be no drawing of straws, rest assured. Thanks for the tacit go-ahead.

Surely this is only of any value in the theocratically inclined states of the USA? Here in Thailand, I can't see any use whatsoever for this, whether it be going to a church or a temple - no one's going to care if I am a believer or not, and no one thinks poorly of me because I am not a believer. I think the same would be the case for the UK - no one gives a toss what you believe or disbelieve. Where else might this have any value aside from the USA? Some parts of Australia?

And just to clarify my position I think that billboards and bus signs are stupid ideas also. I think that spreading atheism is a fucked up notion. You can't preach atheism, it just happens. And I don't really care if anyone becomes an atheist. I just want people to stop believing in stupid shit when the evidence goes against stupid shit.